Episode 19:

Brian Shea is the founder of Shea Consulting where he helps companies streamline their business development systems so they can enjoy consistent, sustainable success. Most business owners flinch at the word “systems” but in reality a system that is simple and repeatable helps free business owners to be more creative, more successful and more profitable.



What you’ll learn about in this episode:

  • Brian’s background in consulting
  • What is keeping smaller companies from utilizing processes and systems
  • Why systems and processes are so crucial for scaling
  • Freeing up capacity through delegation
  • Why processes and systems can often fail inside agencies
  • Making sure the system or process matches the actual problem
  • The four-step assessment Brian uses with his clients for finding the right systems
  • The importance on getting clear with specific goals
  • Who in an agency keeps systems from succeeding
  • How to bring processes to agencies that pride themselves on their creativity
  • What happens when systems aren’t put in place
  • How to solve the scope creep problem
  • What systems every agency needs to have
  • What you can do today to begin being more process driven


The Golden Nugget:

“Systems and software fail because agencies don't get down to the problem.” – @thisBrianShea Click To Tweet

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Speaker 1 (00:00):

Hey, everybody Drew McLellan here. Before we jump into the episode you are about to listen to, I wanted to make sure that you knew that we are doing open mic webinars and they are available to anyone in the world, just head over to the Agency Management Institute.com/ask Drew, and you will see the dates and times for this month and next month. And we’ll talk about anything you want to talk about – agency operations, COVID, whatever it is that is on your mind. I’m happy to answer your questions and everyone else on the call shares as well as asks questions. So it’s really a round-robin of learning for everybody. All right. I’d love to have you there. All you have to do is register. You can attend live, or just get the replay after we record it. Okay. Now here’s that music that you know and love.

Speaker 2 (00:51):

If you’re going to take the risk of running an agency, shouldn’t you get the benefits too? Welcome to Agency Management Institute’s Build A Better Agency podcast presented by HubSpot. We’ll show you how to build an agency that can scale and grow with better clients, invested employees, and best of all, more money to the bottom line. Bringing his 25 plus years of experience as both an agency owner and agency consultant to you, please welcome your host, Drew McLellan.

Speaker 1 (01:25):

This is going to be a great episode of Build A Better Agency.  Drew McLellan here to guide you, to strengthening your agency so you can enjoy all the rewards of business ownership without all of the worries and the headaches. Which is why I know today’s guest is going to rock it for you. So Brian Shea is with us today. Brian is the founder of Shea Consulting and he works with busy companies and helps them do it better. What I love about Brian’s work is he takes companies who are already very successful and already have lots of tools in place, and he helps them put processes and systems, which I know for agency folks are to swear words, into place to streamline, get more done and do the work they’re capable of, their best sales, marketing, and best service to their clients and customers. And so with that, Brian, welcome to the podcast

Speaker 3 (02:12):

Drew, thanks a lot for having me.

Speaker 1 (02:14):

So I want to talk about systems and processes, which as I said, in my introduction to you, are curse words in most agencies, as I know you’ve experienced. Before we dive into that though, give everybody a little bit more information about your background and how you came to start the consulting.

Speaker 3 (02:33):

Sure. So, I spent about 10 years working with a large company or large organizations, large corporate organizations, and a few large nonprofits, specifically higher ed institutions. And I worked in this space sort of sitting in between marketing and technology. So basically, me and my colleagues as both an employee and a consultant, we helped marketing and salespeople basically do their job by putting software in place, by customizing that software for the particular teams we were working for, or working with, putting business processes in place, doing some training, that kind of thing. And I started my own consulting business, working specifically with large companies. I found more and more that smaller companies were reaching out to me or I was talking with smaller companies and they had needs that were similar to the big companies. They were having trouble with their software. They were having trouble getting their sales and marketing done. They were having pain points in their services. I found that working with those smaller companies was, it was a blast. I really enjoyed doing it. Also, there was a niche there for me to serve them. So that’s sort of in a nutshell, my career and how I got started working with, kind of boutique service companies and boutique agencies.

Speaker 1 (03:58):

Okay. So let’s talk a little bit about processes and systems. Why do you think that small businesses are so resistant to the idea of process and system? Because if there is one thing I see across the board when I work with agencies is they give a lot of lip service to the value of process and systems, but man, it kills them to actually implement and maintain one.

Speaker 3 (04:25):

Sure. I think the number one reason why people, especially smaller companies, are resistant to systems is it sounds like, I think when people hear systems and processes, they think, okay, we’re going to stop everything for three months or six months. We’re going to spend a lot of money on consultants and they’re going to put a whole bunch of stuff in place that makes us maybe run more efficiently, but also in a sense be more bureaucratic and more big company like. I totally hear that cause I’ve actually worked on projects like that, but in general, the reason why I work on systems and processes is to really help those smaller companies with the pain points that they’re experiencing day to day. One of my big, learning curves in working with smaller companies, as I said, I worked with larger companies for years and larger companies have big budgets and they’ve got a lot of people and they’ve got a lot of time to do large scale projects.

Speaker 3 (05:33):

One of the things that I had to learn in working with smaller companies is how we can take a lot of the tools and the process and the projects that I do and really implement them very quickly, like, on a scale of four to six weeks. Doing an assessment, figure out what an issue is, and really start to immediately alleviate pain points that small companies are feeling. So I think that’s the number one reason is that feeling of how long is this going to take and how much is this going to cost us? And for a lot of small agencies and small businesses, they were started by dynamic salespeople or dynamic account people or dynamic design and creative people. So the idea of taking that formula and putting it through a system, it doesn’t seem to make sense for a lot of agency owners for good reason.

Speaker 3 (06:32):

Um, so I definitely understand where that, where that’s coming from. But on the flip side, what I hear a lot of companies saying, agency owners, in particular, saying they get to a certain point in their success and they say something to the effect of, um, we keep running into the same wall or my company is successful, but, um, I know it can be so much more or we’re going for this new goal, whether it be a new market or a larger scale client or a new type of project or maybe a product. And they just can’t seem to get traction on it. And oftentimes that’s a process issue in terms of how the team, how their team works together. We’re putting the right tools in place to help them do their work better.

Speaker 1 (07:17):

Yeah. I think agencies get to a certain size where they can kind of chug along by the seat of their pants, but as they start to scale and as the tribe gets big enough, that the tribal knowledge, I can’t know what everybody’s doing all the time anymore. And I can’t have my finger on every project or every client then all of a sudden it’s impossible to scale without some systems in place. Right.

Speaker 3 (07:41):

And one of the things, kind of funny enough, I went back a few weeks ago, I sort of think about, okay, what are the reasons why people come to me? Like, what is the felt need that people have where they pick up the phone and they call me or somebody like me. And one of the things that I’ve found over and over again is companies who have the CEO or somebody very close to the CEO used to handle all the sales, right? And then they hired one or two salespeople, trying to grow the company. And they found that hiring the new salespeople didn’t increase sales at all. It just added work, like added management work and added oversight, all this stuff. And that’s the point where they realized we needed to do something process and systems wise to help the company grow and help these new salespeople be productive in their jobs. So,  there definitely is a point in the scaling or growth mode where systems and processes, you really can’t live without them.

Speaker 1 (08:43):

Well, I had an interesting email conversation with an agency owner yesterday about the whole idea of strategic thinking. And I challenged him because he was talking about the fact that he’s really the only one in his shop who can do that at the level he wants it done. And I said, that’s a learned skill and you could put a process around it or teach it. And, it had never occurred to him. He just assumed that people either had it or don’t have that. And I think that kind of mentality around all kinds of process and system is one of the reasons why they’re not implemented better.

Speaker 3 (09:17):

Right. And a lot of times too, when you think about the agency that either the founder or maybe a small cadre of the people who started early on who were kind of the strategic thinkers in the company, a lot of times those folks are doing a lot of great, amazing strategic work, but they’re also doing a lot of stuff that they don’t want to be doing too. Maybe there are business development activities that they’re doing or administrative tasks that they’re doing or sales or service tasks or aspects of their job that maybe they don’t need to be doing anymore. And oftentimes when we go in and look at their process, it allows them to do a couple of things. The first is just to have transparency into how their business works.

Speaker 3 (10:05):

Because a lot of times it’s sort of in people’s heads, but they don’t have an objective look on, okay, this is actually how we do business. The second thing it allows them to do is to break up their work a little bit more, delegate tasks a little bit more, and this has two benefits. Number one is the founders get to focus on the strategic work that they love to do or that creative work that they love to do, or that BizDev work that they love to do. And the second thing is it allows them to delegate tasks to kind of their next, rung of employees or staff. And it helps to develop those people so they can start doing the higher-level work, you know, a year, two, three down the line. So it helps them develop their organization in general. It can have a lot of non-obvious benefits to put process in place. It’s not only an aspect of, Hey, we can save some time or we can make things run more efficiently, but it can really be about growing your company from a talent perspective to not just like a headcount or dollar perspective.

Speaker 1 (11:08):

Well, and I don’t know if this has been your observation, but I think at least with my sort of lens on agencies, they start a lot of processes and systems, they just don’t stick. So, give me your idea of why they start them and not be able to sustain them.

Speaker 3 (11:28):

Sure. So I think one of the biggest reasons why processes and systems and software fail is because at the beginning, the folks that are trying to implement them a lot of times, they don’t get down to the root cause of what’s actually causing the problem. And before I even talk about process and systems and all that stuff, I was talking with a friend of a fellow business owner and he was saying that he was having problems with his projects. He’s a consultant. He was having problems with his projects. Like he’d get to the end of projects and the project was sort of bleed on longer than he had expected. And they’d sort of start aspects of the project, but not finish them successfully. And the scope of work always seems to get a little bit out of whack.

Speaker 3 (12:19):

And he found that it was happening more like in the last year. So we were sort of chatting and after chatting about this for an hour, what we came to realize was that his problem was that he didn’t have enough leads in his pipeline. And as a result of not having enough leads in his pipeline, what he’s always trying to do is tack on additional stuff onto his existing product. He was trying to say, Hey, we’re going to do this. And then as the project went along, Hey, you also need this as well. So it was causing him to sort of go outside of the scope of the contract, add scope in and do it. And it just wasn’t working. But my point is that the felt need was, Hey, my projects are failing. But the cause of it was, he didn’t have enough leads, a totally different thing.

Speaker 3 (13:03):

Right? And I think where a lot of projects, a lot of systems and process and software fail is they look quickly and they say, man, we’re having a lot of pain on our projects. We need a new piece of project management software. So they go and they implement this big piece of project management software. When, like in this example, the issue has nothing to do with how they run their projects. A little bit has to do with how they run their project, but really the core issue, the root cause is the fact that they didn’t have enough leads. So until you solve the, we don’t have enough leads problem, you’re not going to solve the our projects aren’t going well problems. So I think that for me is the number one issue that people are trying to address the wrong thing with process and systems and whatnot.

Speaker 3 (13:46):

So what we talked about at the beginning in terms of companies, especially small companies, not having the appetite to take on a three, six, nine-month analysis and process building project with good reason. It makes complete sense. So for me, in my business, what I had to do is sort of take the process that I used with big companies, where they did spend three, six, nine months on this and figure out a way to collapse it, into again, four-six weeks to figure out, to do something that I call like a root cause analysis. Figure out what is the true problem here and do it quickly and have specific steps that I go through to do it. That’s sort of the secret sauce to an extent in terms of what I do. There’s a lot of people that can implement software. There’s a lot of people that can help train employees on how to do various things. But I find that until you get good at figuring out what that the root cause is, it doesn’t really matter what you do after that, because you’re sort of shooting it at a moving target.

Speaker 1 (14:55):

So I’m not asking you to give us your secret sauce. Are there some things that agency owners could do if they have identified, man, I’m tired of banging my head against this brick wall? Are there some questions they can ask themselves or are there some symptoms they can look for that might hint at a root cause or a cause at least a little deeper than the surface?

Speaker 3 (15:17):

Sure. Yeah. And I’m happy to give away my secret sauce. I actually believe in that. What I’ll do is I’ll just sort of talk through, and I’m not trying to make a pitch about what I do, but I’ll just talk through how I do the assessment phase of my project. Because I think it tells you if somebody were to do it on their own, how they could do it. So I break my assessment down into four steps. The first one is, we get clear on goals. The second is we look at the current state process and pain points and figure out again, the root cause of those pain points. Three is what should the business process be? Whether it’s a sales process or how a company produces content or whatever the case may be or how they do their services, what should that look like?

Speaker 3 (16:08):

And then the fourth is, uh, what I call implementation options. And basically, those are the tangible things that a company can do, whether it be implementing software processes or what to get from where they are to where they want to go. It’s really as simple as that. In terms of goals, what I try to do when business owners talk about goals and are like, okay, we want to grow. Okay. Or we’re not working on enough of our ideal projects. We want to work on more of this type of client or this size project or whatever the case may be. So the first thing we do and I’m sure you do this same thing is to focus on getting more specific on that. A lot of times when companies say they want to grow, especially with a service business, like an agency, well, there’s a limit to how much they could possibly grow within the next year or two. So figuring out what that is. What their max is, is huge. Because it could be maybe 10% or 20% or one new client a quarter or something. I’m sorry, I cut you off.

Speaker 1 (17:11):

I also think it gives them a sense of relief that, Oh, I’m not hunting for 20 new clients. I’m hunting for three. Exactly.

Speaker 3 (17:19):

Yeah. I was chatting with a lead gen company and they were like, the solution is always more leads. And I would say, absolutely not. Because there’s a lot of companies out there that if they were to get twice as many leads, they couldn’t handle twice as much business. So when you can get clear that the issue is, Hey, we want to get a new one new client a quarter maybe, or I don’t know if they are bigger sized clients, maybe one every six months or something. That’s totally different than we want to double our business in a year. So really clear on that is huge. And like you said, that can be a huge relief to companies. Because they know this is what we actually need to do. It might one new closed project a quarter.

Speaker 3 (18:03):

Then we can take a step back even further and say right now, how many leads does your team generally close? Is it one in seven? Okay, It’s one in seven. So now we have to figure out how to get seven good qualified leads into your pipeline more every quarter so that it becomes much more tangible. That’s the goal side of it. In terms of the current process, again, that’s about figuring out what really is the root cause of the problem. And for that one,

Speaker 3 (18:38):

I find probably if somebody is going to try to do this themselves, I would say the biggest thing that they can do is to talk through the pain that they’re experiencing with somebody, a smart person that they know, maybe a fellow executive at a different company and sort of openly talk about the pain that they’re feeling. One of the biggest things that I bring to clients is not just the experience I have, but just the objectivity of it, where I can kind of, you know what I mean? That’s a tough one to do yourself, but I think if you’re gonna, um, do it, try to get somebody, sort of a peer, somebody who you trust and who’s smart to talk it through with them. That’s figuring out the pain points and then in terms of what their current process should look like and implementation options, I won’t bore you with those, but, as you can imagine, it’s about taking those pain points and figure out the best ways to solve those.

Speaker 1 (19:39):

I knew this was going to be a fascinating conversation and you are not disappointing. I have lots more to ask you, but first, let’s take a quick pause and then come on back., I get this. Sometimes you just can’t get on a plane and spend a couple of days in a live workshop. And so hopefully our online courses are a solution to that. Lots of video, hours and hours of video, a very dense, detailed participants guide, and all kinds of help along the way to make sure that you get the learning that you need and apply it immediately to your agency. Right now we’ve got two courses that are available. We have the Agency New Business Blueprint, and we have the AE Bootcamp. So feel free to check those out at agencymanagementinstitute.com/ondemandcourses. Okay. Let’s get back to the show. So, one of the things that you didn’t mention and I’m sure it’s because you’re nicer than I am, but one of the reasons why I think agencies struggle with processes is because the process is often implemented with this sort of a phrase, I think it would be really awesome if all of you did timesheets.

Speaker 1 (20:50):

Right? And talk to me about sort of the importance of the leadership, setting the example as a new process is being implemented.

Speaker 3 (20:58):

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Before we got on this before you hit the record button, you and I were chatting and I was saying like all business owners, I run into a case of the cobbler shoes. Where there are times that I look at my systems and the way that I run my business, my business process, and say, Hey man, I’m glad there are no clients seeing this because I could really be doing this better and in a more systematic way. But, to your point, with organizations, it, always starts from the top. The CEO or the executive team needs to be on board with the systems to make them work.

Speaker 3 (21:49):

For a couple of reasons. One is because folks look up to the executive team and if the executive team isn’t doing it, nobody else is going to. All the work kind of starts with them and everything, in most organizations, most small organizations, everything very much revolves around the executive team. So it just doesn’t work if they’re not doing it. A lot of the work kind of starts with them. So yeah, it’s critical for the leadership to be on board. And again, I think it goes back to the reluctance to do it, to be more process-oriented, to be more systems-oriented, has to do with stuff that we already talked about. Right? Like it’s going to be too expensive. It’s going to slow us down. It’s going to take too long. It’s going to, we’re the creative group, we’re a sales-driven group. We don’t have time for processes. It’s not what we do. Or the case of feeling like the processes you’re implementing isn’t really solving the problems that need to be solved. And you’re just putting process in for process sake. So, I get why there’s that reluctance, but you’re absolutely right. Like it needs to come from the top or it just doesn’t fly.

Speaker 1 (23:01):

I also think one of the misunderstandings around process and systems is particularly in the agency world. You sort of touched on it earlier, is that it feels bureaucratic or stifling. And regardless of what kind of agency we are, we pride ourselves on the creativity, whether it’s, we’re strategically creative or sort of traditionally creative or whatever it may be. There’s almost an inherent aberration for the idea of the cookie cutter. A lot of agencies talk about, we don’t do cookie-cutter, we do custom solutions. And so address that issue of system and process in that context.

Speaker 3 (23:45):

Sure. One of the things it’s interesting because I work with not just agencies. I work kind of B2B professional services companies. And it’s interesting because some companies very much embrace the idea of process and the, I sort of talked about the steps that I go through in terms of my assessment. That’s something that I’m very upfront about with potential clients or clients. I say this is how we’re going to do it. I do it this way every time. And there is, especially in like the consulting space, that idea of having, sort of our proprietary process, whatever that means or a way that we do things, is very much embraced. So for those types of businesses, a lot of times I have a much easier time making the case for processes and systems, but in terms of what you’re describing … if you’re talking about a branding shop or a boutique design shop, you’re right.

Speaker 3 (24:42):

I mean, they’re very creative. They’re doing extremely creative work that requires a lot of customization, care, and taste, and the idea of bringing the process to that, sounds anathema to it. But what I find is processes in cases like those to help them do things that they don’t necessarily want to do, but do them better. So for instance, different companies have different things that they like to do and don’t like to do, but I know a lot of creative firms, aren’t huge fans of doing sales. Putting a killer sales process in place allows them to do sales, better, make more sales in a much more painless, much more efficient way. So for a company like that, a creative agency, a lot of times there are aspects to their business that they are struggling with and systems and processes allow them to do them better in a more painless way. So that’s the first thing that I think of when you talk about that creative business that doesn’t really embrace systems. It’s not to say that you’re going to take your creative work and turn it into cookie cutter or repeatable or outsourceable, it’s how you’re going to take the aspects of your business that need to be improved and make them work a lot better, so you can do that work. That is the high value add or the important thing that you love to do.

Speaker 1 (26:17):

So let me just see if I can paraphrase. Part of what I’m hearing you say is that a lot of times systems and processes are put in place to minimize the stuff you don’t want to do so you have more time and energy to do this stuff you do want it to do.

Speaker 3:

Yes. Thank you. You said that in 20 seconds what it took me five minutes to say but yes, that’s exactly right.

Speaker 1:

Well, I wouldn’t have been able to say it without you saying it first, so we’re good. So what’s the price of not systemizing? And we talked a little bit about the inability to scale. What are the other consequences, although they are loathed to admit it? I think a lot of agency owners sort of like the fact that they kind of fly by the seat of their pants. So what’s the cost of that.

Speaker 3 (27:00):

So there are a few different things. One of the things that, there’s been a couple of occasions of it recently that I’ve run into, but having processes and I’ll just tell you what the thought that immediately came to mind when you said that. There are a couple of small professional services companies that friends and I knew were sort of in similar circles and they were doing amazing work. The work looked great. They had a great client list and all of a sudden they went out of business. And the reason was that I shouldn’t say the reason was, I don’t know what the reason was, but you see that a lot because the interior of the business isn’t running properly. They’re doing projects internally in a way that maybe isn’t making money or isn’t efficient enough. They’re doing amazing work, but from a business perspective, they’re not running the way they should be.

Speaker 3 (27:59):

So that’s the worst extreme case. But a less scary case is a founder who maybe loves running by the seat of his or her pants, but doesn’t like pulling all-nighters anymore or is just sort of tired of not taking a vacation or an executive team or a team in general, that’s just burnt out. The one that I mentioned before is, we’re trying to grow in a certain area, whether it be hiring more people or getting kind of one or two dream clients, or getting more projects or launching a product and they just can’t seem to get to the next level. It’s kind of all of the above, right? It can be something as small as burnout, which isn’t really a small thing, but it can manifest itself in terms of burnout, or it can manifest itself in really bad stuff like going out of business or it can manifest itself in, we can’t grow in the way that we know we’re capable of. So it can be any of those things.

Speaker 3 (29:11):

I found, again, going back to that idea of goals, I think this is where goals are super important because I’m not an advocate of scaling for scaling sake. If I look at my business, I am one employee in my business. It’s me. I have to work. I have a lot of subcontractors that I work with, but I have no desire, at this point in my life to hire people. So I’m not an advocate of scaling just for scaling sake, but I built a business that works and at a high level, when you see business owners that are struggling and they’ve built businesses that are no longer working for them, or they want them to be in a certain place and they’re not, a lot of times it comes back to looking at goals. Seeing what the pain points are and then fixing the business, whether it’s with a business process or a system or some other thing that helps them to get to where they want to go. So again, long answer, but that’s the answer.

Speaker 1 (30:10):

Well, you mentioned it earlier when you’re talking about your friend whose pain point really was that the pipeline wasn’t full enough. And so they ended up sort of giving away a lot of work to their current clients. I’m sure with the hope that they would then be able to bill those clients for that work. And sometimes they could and sometimes, they could not. As I crawl through a lot of agency’s financials, you know, if there’s one system or process that most of them don’t do well, it is all around scope creep and change and getting change orders done. Holding clients accountable to a scope document as well, backup. Writing a scope document, but then holding the client accountable to that. And so, you know, I think the other cost is literally a cost. It’s the money that is left on the table because you’re over-servicing clients and have no way to recoup that cost. And in some cases, no way to even track that you’re doing that and to understand the magnitude of the loss.

Speaker 3 (31:10):

I’m really, really glad you brought that up. When I was talking earlier about companies that get into trouble, I felt like it was sounding like I was talking about their core financials, but what you’re talking about and what I was thinking of is the question around the scope of projects. This can definitely happen. We were talking about creative business owners. I’ve seen this happen a lot in creative projects where they get so invested in a particular creative vision that the project is losing money. Or they’re not making a lot of money on the client. There’s a way to do both, achieve an amazing creative vision and also have a financially successful business outcome for your agency by doing a few things that I’m sure you’d agree are, in terms of writing scope documents, sticking to scope documents, figuring out ways to communicate with clients in a positive way. They’re not impossible things to solve. They can be relatively straightforward to solve as long as you’re as an agency owner, willing to look at them and willing to take some time to do things the right way. So I totally agree with you on defining the scope and I’ll say, sticking with the scope that you defined for the project.

Speaker 1 (32:31):

There very well may not be an answer to this question. It may be too generic a question, but if an agency is primarily system free, so, you know, they’ve got some process in how they work with clients and all of that, but for the most part, they’re system free. Is there a department or a functionality where that, if they’re going to start to systemize, if they’re going to start to kind of put on their big boy or big girl pants and start to scale to the aspect level where an agency owner doesn’t have to be there every day and doesn’t have to be in every meeting, but really is able to work on the business rather than in the business? Are there some systems that every business needs to have?

Speaker 3 (33:14):

I’m going to give you two answers. I’m going to give you a philosophical answer. And then the second one is sort of the real world answer. The philosophical one would be again with the idea of looking at goals and pain points. I say start where, identify where the pain point is, the true pain point, and start there. That’s sort of the philosophical answer. The real-world answer is, especially for agencies, is over and over again, having a great, I don’t want to say a great CRM, having a CRM in place and having, a way that your business, your people, the people in your business who need to do business development, having them know how to use it. And having, I’ll use the word process for how they do business development. I’d say is the one thing, the biggest thing for service-based businesses.

Speaker 3 (34:05):

People want to go nuts when they talk about marketing technology in terms of all these fantastic things you can do in terms of marketing automation and content creation, all these different things, which are awesome. But for service-based businesses, again and again, with the kind of the companies that I work with, when you dig I,n the ones that have a solid CRM and a solid process around their CRM, those are the ones that are just doing well over and over and over again. Start with CRM, as a kind of that real-world example. That’s a great place to start.

Speaker 1 (34:43):

Yeah. New business solves a lot of problems. And, and it also surfaces other problems. Again, as you grow, but it’s a lot easier to solve those problems when you’re feeling fat and happy as opposed to when you’re scrambling to make payroll.

Speaker 3 (34:59):

Yes. It’s CRM and new business is a fantastic place to start, especially again, because some agencies grow up driven by an account person or a salesperson. So for them, CRM and new business is very much in their DNA, but for other companies that grow up from more of a creative direction, a lot of times sales is not something that they like to do. So, for those companies, especially like, spending some time thinking about how you generate new business, putting in the stuff doesn’t even need to be that complex, but putting a CRM in place s a huge step forward.

Speaker 1 (35:44):

A lot of agencies when I talked to them about how they get new business, the most common answer of course is, Oh, well, it’s all by referral. Well, at a certain point in time, you have to work with people who don’t know someone. Otherwise, sitting back and waiting for clients or prospects to walk in the door, either through referral or however they may find you, means that’s your choice set right there. As opposed to you being really conscious about these are the kind of companies I want to work with. These are the kinds of clients that we can really delight on a day in day out basis. So I want more of those.

Speaker 3 (36:20):

Yeah. Obviously, there’s nothing wrong with word of mouth. It’s a great place to have been. You can definitely add on to it. And I know it’s funny. I was chatting with somebody and he was giving the example. I think everybody has heard this sort of story before of the creative design person who has no website, who does no marketing, who does no business development and has all this business and that’s all well and good. Like I’m sure those people are out there and doing great, but you know, there are ways to put a new business program in place that doesn’t need to necessarily take a lot of time and can really, really change a business for the better. And I will make a plug for your fantastic, macro micro and nano framework, that I think everybody should read because it’s fantastic.

Speaker 1 (37:12):

Ah, thank you very much. I’m sure the listeners are tired of hearing nagging them about it. So we could probably continue this for quite some time, but I, I want to be respectful of your time and I want to kind of wrap this up, but I like to end every podcast with something really tangible and practical that our listeners can take some action on right away. So if there are two or three things that you would say to everybody listening, go back to your shop and do this. If you want to get a little more process-driven or a little more system-driven, or if you want to identify where you need to start, what would you suggest that they go back and do?

Speaker 3 (37:52):

I am going to pick up the nano piece of your framework because I think it’s great for business and I think it also illustrates how processes can be great for companies. So part of that nano piece of your framework was to choose, I think you said 25 dream clients. And basically to love these folks to death until you either, what is it? Number one, they hire you, or number two, they tell you to go away. Those are the two choices. And the thing with that is 25, 25 is a lot for a lot of people. It doesn’t sound like many, but I’ve actually told the ones that I’ve talked to not try to do 25. Do either a dozen or

Speaker 3 (38:39):

18, because they were a little bit smaller companies. But what I loved about the article and I think this is what illustrates process is to think about, let’s say you’ve got a dozen realistic, but dream clients that your agency would love to work with and take that list and think through the next 12 months. Think about over the next 12 months, what is the information that you could give them that would help them? What are the things that you can do? What are the things that you can send them that would not only help them but keep you top of mind and show off your expertise? And that could take the form of, I remember you mentioned snail-mailing, a great book that you read, preferably a book that you wrote, or a white paper that your business created showing off helping them, but also showing off your expertise, but taking that in thinking out a year in advance and putting those things in place.

Speaker 3 (39:33):

So they’re done consistently and that’s, we haven’t talked about that, but that’s another huge benefit of putting a process in place, especially with sales is consistency, is keeping in touch with that prospect that contacted you at the end of 2014 and said, I’m not ready to buy yet but I’d love to keep in touch. And then keeping in touch with them in a way where whenever they are ready to buy, they think of you and you’re top of mind and you’ve shown off your expertise to them. I would say for folks out there definitely take that idea of the nano framework, pick out two dozen dream clients and think of a process for keeping in touch with them in a consistent way. Cause I think I was telling somebody that if a company does that with a dozen prospects, if you do that in a, for a year, I mean, Drew, what do you think? I mean, how many new clients out of those dozen would you get? I would say you get one, you might get two. I mean that’s fantastic. Do you know what I mean? I mean, that’s fantastic to get one or two like dream clients.

Speaker 1 (40:46):

And again, if you’re building your list, right, they are of the size that you don’t need a dozen of them. You’d only need one or two a year. And that would round out your client base. Beautiful. Right,

Speaker 3 (40:56):

Exactly. Yeah. So it’s if you take that idea if you’re a boutique agency owner, what would one or two ideal perfect dream clients in the next year do for your business? A lot of people would say that would be huge. That’s our number one thing. And to take it, walk it back at the steps in the process you need to go through to do that. It seems almost like, it seems almost too simple, right? Pick 12 prospects, love them to death in a consistent way. And you’re probably going to get one or two. So yeah, to answer your question, that is my one tip. That is my one takeaway.

Speaker 1 (41:33):

Well, and as you know, it sounds simple, but, but most folks don’t and won’t do it. And so that’s again where you can stand out as if you actually do it consistently and they hear from you every six weeks or so. They’re going to remember you.

Speaker 3 (41:47):

Yup. The last thing I was going to say, I was talking with our mutual friend, Susan Baier about this, and we were talking about how a lot of the stuff out there, to grow a great business is its sort of like the advice to give somebody if they want it to run a marathon, right? Like you gotta run consistently. You gotta eat right. You gotta make sure you get enough sleep, but like there’s no secret weapon here. It’s just about doing the fundamentals consistently over time. You’re absolutely right with that nano strategy. It’s not rocket science, but there’s not a lot of companies that actually do something like that. And it really helps them to stand apart.

Speaker 1 (42:23):

Yeah, absolutely. Okay. So Brian, if folks want to hear more from you, if they want to read your blog, if they want to find out more about your business, what is the best way for them to track you down?

Speaker 3 (42:36):

Sure. So they can go to my consulting site. It’s Sheaconsulting.biz. and I also have a blog that I write as well as a newsletter. So people can check that out at Sheaconsulting.biz/blog.

Speaker 1 (42:57):

Yeah. It’s great content in it. And it’s good practical content. One of the things I like about the work that you do is, it’s not theory. It’s not, you know, all about the philosophy, It’s let’s just roll up our sleeves and figure this out. It’s very pragmatic, which is, I think helpful. Which is, you know, would be nice if everybody’s content was that way. But, yours certainly is. So I strongly encourage our listeners to go check that out. And I think you’re gonna find a lot of good suggestions that you can put into play right away.

Speaker 3 (43:29):

Well, I really appreciate you saying that, Drew. Especially coming from you. It means a lot. So thanks.

Speaker 1 (43:33):

So Brian, thank you so much for your time. I really am so grateful that you are so generous with not only your time but with sharing your expertise. I know a lot of folks, even if they heard that we were talking about systems and process in the beginning, I think now that they’ve listened to all podcasts, maybe it’s not so scary to them. And hopefully, they’ll embrace some of your suggestions soon because I think you and I both know that that will help them. Thank you.

Speaker 2 (43:55):

That’s all for this episode of Build A Better Agency, brought to you by HubSpot. Be sure to visit AgencyManagementInstitute.com to learn more about our workshops, online courses, and other ways we serve small to midsize agencies. Don’t miss an episode as we help you build the agency you’ve always dreamed of owning.